I will soon be sharing a couple of posts on usability in CRM systems as well as some thoughts on the role of AI in mining social data for your CRM system. However, in the mean-time, I am putting most of my mental energy towards some internal projects I have underway.
Instead of me, and others, preaching our beliefs on why you are not using your company’s CRM system, I would like to ask you directly. Take a minute and let me know what the biggest obstacles are for you, what is your number one reason for not fully leveraging your company’s investment in CRM.
If you do not see your reason listed, let me know and I’ll add it. If you have additional thoughts you’d like to share please leave a comment, everyone will benefit more.
John
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June 29, 2009 at 6:57 pm
John,
Thanks for facilitating such a good discussion. See my thoughts here. Others, interested in your additional feedback here or on my blog.
http://freecrmstrategies.wordpress.com/2009/06/29/the-challenge-with-crm-system-initiatives/
June 29, 2009 at 5:24 pm
[...] 29, 2009 John Moore, on his recent blog post, Why aren’t you using your CRM system more? has facilitated a meaningful conversation which has triggered some very productive dialogue related [...]
June 26, 2009 at 3:19 pm
Excellent discussion. I add several several suggestions here: http://tinyurl.com/nspea2
June 26, 2009 at 3:35 pm
Fantastic additions to the post, thanks Glenn.
John
June 26, 2009 at 12:48 pm
I’ve spent a lot of time in the past 7-8 years working two related systems; CRM and SharePoint. Both can be difficult implementations to get right because you cannot just turn on the software and expect great things to happen. It takes a lot of thought, planning, and most importantly cultural change to get the organization to see the value. Integration can also be critical to both of those systems.
Get users involved early, and address the concerns as quickly as possible.
June 26, 2009 at 12:51 pm
Great feedback, Mike. SharePoint is a great example of another application that people often feel will be a “silver bullet”. It is an investment, do your homework.
John
June 26, 2009 at 12:42 pm
In one of the LinkedIn groups I belong to someone mentioned that some stats show a 25% success rate with CRM implementations. To be honest with you, I am surprised that 25% of CRM implementations succeed. Too many people look at CRM and expect it to be a magic solution to all of their business problems. We all understand it is not but it is amazing to me when I hear the naive perceptions some people still have.
While I will pull together a summary of all the discussions soon I want to leave one comment here on Friday morning (my time):
“If your CRM implementation fails it is your fault, not the vendors fault”.
Why do I say this? You must understand your vision, your processes first, if you do not, no tool will get you past that. Once you understand those pieces you choose the vendor. In today’s world it is easy to dive past the hype that the sales people throw your way. If you do not do your homework first you are no better than the person that brings a hundred thousand dollars to the Casino’s in Monaco only to be surprised when they leave with nothing.
John
June 26, 2009 at 3:44 pm
it is always your fault. the vendor provides the software, you must figure out what you want to do with the software. most of the largest failures of crm came from people who took the software provided and tried to mold their functions around it. that was the recommended mode of implementation initially for siebel systems.
yes, the vendor’s sales people were clueless about it. but the companies that followed that advice were even worse.
June 25, 2009 at 10:19 pm
John,
Been reading these comments, following what others are saying in Twitter and elsewhere lately and i saddens me that we are back to square one with CRM.
Back in the days when we first started doing this strategically we said it is not about the software or the features: it is about a strategy. alas, all I hear is how the software is hard, unfair, imposed on users, etc.
Let’s try this again. Software has nothing to do with CRM. In fact, the best CRM solutions we deployed had nothing to do with software. or Processes. They were successful because of three things:
1. culture (some of that has been spread through these comments). need to get people to become customer-centric and think about the customer first. this involves training, compensation, hr policies, hiring, etc. no software can ever make a worker (yes, even at the management level) care about the customer.
2. change management. there are changes (software -yes, but also processes, training, job descriptions, etc.) that need to be managed properly. this goes beyond the culture and being customer-centric – itis about managing employee expectations and understanding of their benefits (most of the complaints about whose data or what process go away in change management). again, no software here.
3. management compensation. how do you think you get management buy-in faster/easier/cheaper/better? tell them what they get from endorsing a system. if you measure your management on operational metrics, and then try to get them to buy into something else — it ain’g going to happen. bribing? such a bad word… i prefer incentivizing the proper behavior. definitely no software here.
bl: it is not about processes, or software, or who does what. it is about making people line up behind it, and manage the change to ensure agreement.
(notice that this is a longer and more detailed rant from my first comment).
Nice discussion…
June 26, 2009 at 12:05 am
Yes. Business vision, strategy, and processes MUST come first.
From there you automate the processes using CRM. This automation system, which we refer to as CRM or even in the future tense with Social CRM, can only be as good as the processes it is built to support.
With that said, however, we must be aware of the fact that there are far too many bad CRM roll-outs that have occurred, leaving CRM with a bad reputation. The poor usability, the poor communication about company and personal benefits of using the CRM system, all lead to low adoption and to further bad expiences.
We must attack business improvement on all fronts. Educating leaders and their teams on the benefits of process improvements, focused execution, and constant measurement will make the difference. We must back this, however, with systems that support this view of the world. One without the other will only lead to failure.
John
June 26, 2009 at 3:43 pm
John,
You make an interesting point, but this is where syntax and semantics make it not so powerful.
CRM was devised in the early 1990s as a way to connect the front-office functions (service, sales, marketing) together and provide organizations with a method to provide end-to-end computer support when dealing with customer relationships. The promised “benefits” included a 360-degree view of the customer, lots of profile information, and the ability to manage the relationships to create long-term loyal relationships. That was, and continues to be, the stated purpose.
CRM never happened, nor do I believe that it could ever happen.
I do think that for some, few, organizations implementing CRM solutions was an advance in the way they dealt with their customers. Salespeople had access to more and better information to provide to prospects and customers. Marketing had access to more complete profiles for prospects and customers. Service was able to track service events and track them to other existing information. Probably service was the one that benefited the most from the CRM systems, if you consider that prior to 2000 (last survey we did at Garter) over 90% of call centers had no formal system to manage service events. None.
However, the integration between functions happened very, very seldom and usually in small projects- not at the enterprise level. You can count in, maybe, two hands the number of true CRM solutions that have taken advantage of cross-function optimization. Maybe less than that.
Now, CRM was great from many other aspects. Being able to automate some transactions, as you say above, keep a centralized and better profile and history information on customers, provide software to carry out functions previously done manually or on separate systems. There is certainly lots of value that was provided to the enterprise.
But the main premise of CRM – end-to-end support for front-office processes — that never happened. And probably won’t. Which is why I say that CRM is not a has-been, it is a never-was.
(btw, i shortened the progress of CRM from its genesis to keep it short. if you want more details we can break down the failure into the use of transactional, operational, analytical, and now social crm).
great discussion.
June 26, 2009 at 3:57 pm
Thanks Esteban, truly excellent points (as always).
The words are a bigger part of the communication problem than I had originally thought. To many, CRM is that software in the back room that we have to use. To me, and others, it is a combination of processes and tools that automate execution tactics, provide analytic data, etc.. that makes the company “better” in terms of selling, providing services, etc..
Now, the definition you use, which is a grander view of CRM than I have had (ignoring social CRM for a moment) has not been achieved. In truth, I would argue, it is not what most companies even have in mind when they think about deploying CRM (again, many just consider it a tool, ignoring processes et al).
While I have much to think about I would be willing to say:
- Esteban’s vision of CRM (the original definition) has yet to become reality. I believe we can continue moving towards that with social CRM. However, it is either dead or never really existed.
- My vision of CRM as a vision, a series of processes, working in combination with a tool known as CRM, is very much alive. Successful implementations are far lower than they should be, however.
Enjoying the discussion.
John
June 26, 2009 at 4:02 pm
I will agree that the few people that have succeeded with CRM implementations are closer to what you propose.
Using the tools and leveraging the technology that CRM systems provide (maybe just the data model, or the campaign management tools, or analytical power) is what CRM has become. And it is how it is successful. The model you describe is how CRM becomes powerful.
It is also why CRM became a strategy, not a tool or software. But, that is fodder for additional discussions.
June 26, 2009 at 4:05 pm
I am looking forward to that series of conversations as well.
John
June 27, 2009 at 2:17 am
Hi John I think you’re getting close to one of the source issues. In business (or anywhere) two concepts using one name equals confusion. In the SME space (where I work) CRM is software pure and simple. Why don’t we interested parties just accept that and get on with finding some clarifying language for the the customer “stuff” other than the software. My vote still goes for Customer Management.
June 25, 2009 at 6:55 pm
There are a host of reasons. Here are my “top four”:
1. The decision was made “for” the users, not “by” them. Thus they have no skin in the game, resulting in low participation. Add to this that the decision makers did not communicate to the users why the CRM was being implemented.
2. My contacts are MINE, not yours. Users in professional services companies consider their book of business as a high valued asset and are not prone to sharing.
3. YOUR CRM is changing MY data. My contact information is right and yours is wrong! This is a variation on the validity of the data in the firm database. While a user does not have to accept a change, the mere idea that someone else’s data is not the same is cause for unhappiness.
4. The data in the CRM is a mess. There are duplicates and much of the data is personal and therefore not relevant.
While there are many reasons to avoid adoption, most companies have passive users. They don’t understand why the firm needs the data and who is “in charge.” They see no value in the CRM becuase no one has explained why the CRM is there in the first place.
June 25, 2009 at 6:59 pm
Great feedback Sue. My favorite line is “My contacts are MINE, not yours.” . There is often the disagreement of ownership of leads and contacts. Sales people feel these are there, the company feels otherwise. If this is not handled in a positive manner than buy-in never occurs.
John
June 25, 2009 at 4:56 pm
My view as a data steward seeing what reactions end-users have about CRM is that they’re just simply LAZY. “Oh, it’s too hard.” “Too much to learn.” “It’s over my head.” These are the excuses I’ve heard – from officers and principles of the firm I work at, who have college degrees and PhDs. Too hard? Ah, the poor things – IT’S THAT THEY’RE LAZY. How frigging hard is it to fill in simple fields like Job Title? Phone numbers? DUH! Yet – seemingly pillars of the business community making 6 figure salaries are stumped by adding in a new contact in a piece of software that I – as a non-college graduate had mastered in 3 hours by teaching myself. Sorry, but I’m being brutally honest here – and if everyone else out there was – they’d have to admit to the same thing.
June 25, 2009 at 12:15 pm
Some of the keys to successful CRM rollout would include:
Strategic fit and purpose (answer the q: how and why crm will make this a better organization)
Management buy-in
Management involvement (you cant delagate responsibility)
Employee buy-in
Value added to employees (too often they are “left behind” and implementation does not consider thir needs and wants)
Change management
Clear process definition
KPI definition
Technology concerns (integration issues)
Data quality and MANAGEMENT
Analytics (how will data be used)
These are some for starters…
Feel free to add more as you see fit!
June 25, 2009 at 4:26 pm
John and Everybody – Forgive me. I’ll add something here that I won’t play web-coy and pretend it’s some awesome app I just heard about – this is my app and my company. This rides on top of salesforce.com and it is an answer to so many of the issues raised in responses to this question here and on LinkedIn. Please- anyone who has 10 minutes, please watch our video tour of many of the high points of what we do. It’s totally process-centric, yet presents the process as a way to SPEED opportunities and shorten the amount of time people use the system. Change management principles are core to how we let people get used to a spreadsheet interface and then reveal more and more strategy-centric detail. Plus it’s got graphics that give top management a real reason to stay involved with the system. IT doesn’t just give them answers – it helps them develop strategies AND provide the tools to execute on a truly granular level.
I would really appreciate the thoughts and ideas of these great writers who know what the answer is – does Pipeline Manager finally deliver a tangible way to get these great answers into every CRM user’s daily grind?
http://www.pipelinemanager.com/FullDemoFLV.html
In case you’d like to see what others think, we have a few reviews on the Salesforce AppExchange:
http://sites.force.com/appexchange/apex/listingDetail?listingId=a0N300000016cfqEAA
Every idea, reaction or critique will be appreciated!
June 25, 2009 at 5:29 pm
Thank you for being upfront Michael. I’ll spend 10 minutes this weekend checking it out, I’ll encourage others to do the same.
John
June 26, 2009 at 12:17 am
John your last post highlights one of the key issues around language. I think we need to split the CRM software component from the “CRM systems” element. Using CRM for both is very confusing for the business person trying to get his/her head around this topic for the first time. My preference is to use Customer Management as the catch all name for processes, systems etc etc that result in better relationships and experiences.
June 24, 2009 at 8:33 pm
One can say that CRM systems as such do not exist: After considerate analysis and planning a “system” can be chosen/designed and implemented (and now I am cutting quite a few corners here); but if the corporate vision and strategy are not “CRM” in their core and if the company at every level isn’t “speaking” CRM in all of its actions and processes, to all of its customers through all touchpoints, the utilization will start slipping.
If CRM isn’t implemented throughout, frustrated employees will be the result in the weak areas or in the areas without proper implementation, deteriorating the process.
Or briefly: One cannot apply a little CRM here and there … Unless you go all the way it will result in less than nothing.
June 23, 2009 at 5:30 pm
I would say the last one about processes is close. It probably stems from a lack of overall strategy, leadership, and cross-functional participation in its development
June 25, 2009 at 2:32 am
I think the key issue is a lack of competency and understanding of Customer Management in all its facets. CRM software is simply one of the tools of Customer Management (as is change management discipline)
June 23, 2009 at 3:53 pm
So,
I don’t have a CRM system, but I have implemented many. and all the reasons you have up there can be better summed up in one concept: lack of a change management discipline. Any user who complains that their system is slow, does not work, does it wrong, etc. is actually saying “i was never consulted about how to do this, and whether it is right or wrong, i am going to complain”.
in other words: lack of change management. and that is indeed the cause of most of the CRM failures that make it to deployment (the other ones usually die from lack of strategy)
would be interesting to see the results…
June 23, 2009 at 3:58 pm
Great feedback, thanks. As long as I can get a reasonable amount of voting I will share the results so we can all discuss.
John